Episode 19: The Power of Personality Tests for Writers

Angela Haas (00:17)
Welcome to episode 19. I'm Angela Haas and I'm here with my co-host Cassie Newell and this month we're talking about finding industry professionals that are going to help you with your author journey. But before you can do that, we think it's best if you look inward and try to understand yourself better, which is why

some authors take personality tests and some groups and teachers want you to also take personality tests just so that you can have a better understanding of who you are as a writer. But it also helps you understand who you work with better along the way. So the three tests we're gonna talk about today are the CliftonStrengths,

Myers-Briggs and the Enneagram, what we are and our experiences with them, Remember when you get on a plane, they tell you to put your oxygen mask on first before helping others, right? We're going to start by looking at us, taking care of us, and then it helps us connect better with those around us. So, Cassie.

Why don't you start? you've taken all these three tests, which one do you like better?

Cassie Newell (01:28)
I don't know Easter.

Yeah, and I've taken a number of these and the disc profile as well in my professional setting, right? So the Myers-Briggs I took years and years ago. And then in 2023, I took it again just for, you know, kicks and giggles because, you know, sometimes it's always fun to check in with that to see if anything's changed. And it had, I believe on one letter, but that was it.

Angela Haas (01:38)
yes, I've done that.

Cassie Newell (02:02)
but I'm an E E N F J, which we can go into that a little bit. And I remember thinking, yeah, that's kind of me sorta kinda. I also took the Enneagram. and this was part of a course that I took. actually it was around authors, something Becca Syme offered. So you took the Enneagram as well as your CliftonStrengths. And for the Enneagram, I'm an eight challenger and.

It also is a very robust report, more so than Myers-Briggs, in that it talks about your various wings of this type of Enneagram personality number. And I just found it really cumbersome for me. I didn't really understand it. Some of it I was like, yeah, okay, sure. But not all of it. And when I took the CliftonStrengths,

It was like voodoo science to me, because I was like, oh my God, that's me on a page. When you take the full 34, you get like this theme report and these other signature reports. And I just remember reading it going, oh my gosh, that is me, because it tells you kind of what you do really well. And in those certain strengths, what

may not go very well for you kind of your opposites and things to look out for and I was like, wow, I've done that in my life. These are these are the things and so for me, CliftonStrengths, I think resonates the best for me. How about you?

Angela Haas (03:30)
For me, the CliftonStrengths really was helpful because it really gave me so much more detail. It actually helped me understand how I work as an author and my writing process and how I put a story together because there was a time when I get so frustrated with myself where I'm like,

man, I just don't have this skill. Why can't I write like this person? Why can't I do this really well when I'm writing? And my Clifton strengths are all thinking strengths, strategy strengths. And so that helped me so much understand because when I write, I'm so about stitching the plot together. It's like a puzzle and putting pieces together. I'm thinking of the plot, the strategy.

I do have strengths that allow me to build characters well in that I'm always in my just normal life wondering how people work. Like what makes people tick? Why do people make the decisions that they do? And that helps me with characters, but I struggle with

weaving in the emotional beats and I've had editors be like, you need a lot more emotion in this scene. And I'm like, okay. Well, she did just lose her mother. And I'm like, yeah, she should probably cry or something. You know, not that basic, but I'm just like, yeah, because that comes later for me as far as like what I think through first. But once I took the Clifton Strengths,

Cassie Newell (04:50)
Yeah.

Angela Haas (05:01)
And I started to understand that I was like, wow, okay, so I can stop being so hard on myself and understand how to better make my personality work for me when I'm writing. So that helped, but I also gravitate to the Meyers-Brigg because I do a lot of training with that. But since we both like CliftonStrengths, maybe we should talk about what

Cassie Newell (05:14)
right.

Angela Haas (05:27)
Like what ours are I know that when you're in author circles, they kind of focus on the top five or ten and For listeners who don't know the Clifton strengths It's a little bit more of a comprehensive test I know if you follow Becca Syme or Sasha Black They refer to this a lot and they also when you're taking their courses encourage you to take this but it's through Gallup which

Cassie Newell (05:31)
Yeah. Yeah.

Angela Haas (05:51)
does a lot of polling It's a, it's a more intensive comprehensive test, but I know that you focus on your top

Cassie Newell (05:54)
Yeah.

Angela Haas (06:00)
And how are they divided? It's thinking, feeling, yeah. Pull it out and tell us.

Cassie Newell (06:03)
Yeah, so I pulled out my little workbook here. So it's executing

themes and that's how you make things happen. Influencing themes that help you take charge, speak up, make sure others are heard. Relationship building themes which help you build strong relationships that hold a team together. And then strategic thinking, themes that help you absorb, analyze information and inform better decisions. So it's really these four themes across

the 34 pieces of personality, if you will. And they're just kind of color coded that way when you get your report. And I've, I use this also in my corporate life and my day job too, because I find, I know where I lean into in that job. So it's, it's really interesting to me. So I use it both creatively and from a corporate perspective.

Angela Haas (06:53)
Awesome, yeah, and what are your top 10 just for us?

Cassie Newell (06:57)
Sure. I tend to, as I was learning CliftonStrengths, I really recommend people really hone in on their top five and then kind of go to your next five and then your next five, because I don't go really beyond 15 at this point. But my number one is Relator, which is a relationship building theme. And what's funny is it's the only blue, it's color coded, it's the only blue I have in my top 10.

Angela Haas (07:22)
Yeah.

Cassie Newell (07:25)
which I know helps me write dialogue and develop dynamic characters. So that's a natural strength for me. The second one is not my favorite strength. it takes me down rabbit holes, but it's maximizer. It's an influencing strength. And I'm just gonna say right now, it's very odd for most women, but I'm a high influencing strength person. So most of the influencing strengths are in my top 10.

Angela Haas (07:29)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (07:49)
So maximizer is number two, significance is number three, and then I get an executing strengths which is achiever at number four, and then I have a strategic thinking one, which is strategic at number five. Then six is command, seven is communication, eight is self assurance, nine is learner, and 10 is activator. And yeah, ending there on an influencing strength, so.

What about yours?

Angela Haas (08:15)
Wow.

Well, mine are, I actually have a lot of oranges or yellows. So mine are a lot of influencing themes. I have one relationship building in the top 10, a couple strategic and then executing. But my number one is strategic. And I think that's where my strength of plot building comes from.

Cassie Newell (08:24)
Yeah.

Angela Haas (08:40)
Cause I'm always thinking of holes and I just, really love putting that plot together. Number two is individualization. And that's where you really love understanding what makes people tick and what makes people the individuals they are. And I think that helps me with characters, but it also helps me as a manager in my retail life, because when you're working on a team, you really have to understand.

Okay, well this person's strengths are this. So I'm going to put them in customer service. This person is more introverted, but they're more analytical. So I'm going to put them in the warehouse doing data entry. You know, it really helps you put people where they're supposed to be. Third is communication, and this was something interesting that I learned about myself is that it, I always had to hire in the beginning of my writing career, a coach because

I needed to talk out loud to someone about problems or places I was getting stuck. When I talk out loud, it helps me process better. And so I was just like, wow, I knew I was doing it, but I didn't know why. And that also helps me understand sometimes when we're leaving WhatsApp messages, you may not get them till the morning.

Cassie Newell (09:55)
Right.

Angela Haas (10:02)
But the fact that I can talk out loud if I'm having a plot problem, that piece is so helpful. And then it's activator input for my top five, analytical competition, maximizer, focus, significance. and then the relationship ones are so at the bottom, like harmony, Includer.

Cassie Newell (10:23)
Yeah, but what I love about CliftonStrengths

that makes it so different from a lot of the other personality tests that I've taken before, and this is what I love about it. When you dig in, the idea is that don't even look at the bottom. A lot of corporate tests and when you look at these personality tests, well, if you want to improve on this, you start doing activities to improve those personality keys that are at the bottom. CliftonStrengths is like,

Angela Haas (10:37)
Yeah.

Cassie Newell (10:50)
Don't worry about it. Lean into what you're naturally good at and 300X it versus 100Xing it. What that means is, for example, and I'm just gonna use a very layman term thing. Let's just say I'm a really fast reader, naturally. Angela is not. And we both want to continue to work on being fast readers. Well, I will 300X my reading speed just because I'm practicing at it.

She may get to 100x, but she'll never surpass me. But let's just say she's a faster writer than I am, right? She should be doing that thing. So it's, even though I'm talking task-based, that's what the personality side of things are. So when you were talking about strategic, for example, like figuring out the puzzle, and it may not be in like the perfect package upfront, but you can do that later, right?

That's kind of how you're writing. I'm writing from a, I love character based stories. Everything to me, a character drives a story. So I don't look at setting as the driving piece usually. And if I do have a setting, like for example, a novel I'm working on, I make it a character so that it's a little bit more resonant for me as a writer because Relator is number one for me. So.

Once you know those things and you kind of get hip to this language, and you know when things aren't going well for you, that the term that they use is about balconies and basements like you're in the basement right now for that one piece of your personality that's in your top 10. And you realize that you know what to do in order to bring yourself back up to the baseline or even up into the balcony. And I find that

really advantageous. My one strength that causes me the most problems early on is Maximizer. Because what Maximizer is, is something that's really good. I can see it and make it superb. That's what Maximizer makes me do. And I know it. So I can just stop. I'm really like, no, it's good enough. Good enough. I don't need it to be superb right now. Or

Angela Haas (12:42)
Ha!

Cassie Newell (13:01)
I see that, let's say I've built something and I can see where I can tweak it to make it, you know, X times better. In my head, I have to evaluate is X time better, really better? Or is it just something that's needling me? And is it worth my time to do that? So that's, that's the one that has caused me the most problems. And I have to be careful because

Angela Haas (13:14)
Right. ⁓

Cassie Newell (13:27)
For influencing strengths and a lot of these, they tend to pair up well in certain ways too. So then I have to understand what it's pairing up with. So, yeah.

Angela Haas (13:37)
Yeah.

what was it like before you had that awareness as a writer? Was it just like, whoa? Yeah.

Cassie Newell (13:45)
It was almost confirmation, like I said, do science.

Like when I realized I was a number one relator, was like, no wonder I love dialogue and writing about characters. Like the first thing I think about isn't the setting, it's the characters. I think my why very beginning of my young adult fantasy, it was all about having a female heroine that wasn't a victim who could save herself and those around her.

Right? It's like nothing to do with the fantasy world yet or any of this other stuff. You know what I mean? Like I knew her name. I knew what she looked like. I knew her personality. Like those were the things that's what drives me. Yeah. And so when you know that you just kind of lean in. Right.

Angela Haas (14:15)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes, absolutely. Yeah, my strength, think that gets me in trouble is the input. Because sometimes I get so caught up in trying to get information, I feel like I'm constantly craving that input.

And then it's almost like, my gosh, there's too much information in here. Then I may not be able to sort through it very well. And then, especially when I partner that with something that we'll talk about with Myers-Briggs, where I'm like always generating new ideas and always getting input for those ideas. Then I'm like, well, I love the fact finding and research part of this piece, but I'm actually not writing.

Sometimes I don't just start just start writing you don't have to have Every piece of research figured out every you know thing all in place before you start sometimes it stops me from just beginning and That's what it helped me recognize that and then like okay, just just right just write what comes to you That's what I constantly have to tell myself when I spend so much time going down rabbit holes

Cassie Newell (15:33)
Yeah.

Angela Haas (15:46)
And I think the analytical part can also, that's so high too. I'm always like, yeah, but it could be this, but it could be this. Then I've got Maximizer in there. I am so, I'm so spinning my wheels sometimes because I can't start until it's perfect or every character is completely fleshed out or everything. That's where my strengths get in the way. So.

Cassie Newell (15:57)
Welcome.

Yeah.

Well, my command

helps guide me a lot of the noise, which I'm happy I have it. I think learner for me too, like I have to watch myself on that because that will, it's a lot like input for me, but I'm constantly learning, but I need to be physically learning a lot of the time.

Angela Haas (16:15)
Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (16:34)
and set aside time. for me, like live classes, way better than self classes, because I will get distracted, I'll get bored, I'll fast forward, especially if it's very lecture based, because I just can't. At my age, I'm like, don't lecture to me. So yeah, I like practical things. Yeah, I don't know. It's interesting because significance

Angela Haas (16:41)
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (16:59)
I used to really not like it. And now that I know more about it, and I think that's what's interesting to me too, is about CliftonStrengths and the combination of things. Like you tend to learn more and more as you're kind of in the community that is talking about it or studying it or, and you can start to see it in some of your friends when you find out they're CliftonStrengths.

Angela Haas (17:04)
Yeah.

Cassie Newell (17:24)
I made my entire family take the test. I was like, I want to know. And what amazed me was my husband was almost the exact same strengths in just different orders. He's a number one relator to I was floored. I was like, wait, what? So, I don't know, I find it really interesting. But I also think to once you understand your top 10,

Angela Haas (17:28)
huh.

Cassie Newell (17:49)
you realize that some of your 15 is also very influencing ⁓ too because of those combinations. But I never even look beyond that. So I just kind of studied my own. I don't know. I found it really helpful, very eye-opening and almost, as I said, it was just almost confirmation of things that I thought. And then it allowed me to be really commanding and like, yep, I know my self-assurance.

Angela Haas (17:53)
Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (18:16)
that whole thing like, okay, I got it. You know, so yeah.

Angela Haas (18:20)
Yeah,

my I have number 10 significance, but I think that gets in the way of me really accepting bad reviews. Well, I mean, part of significance is you want your work to you want to feel like it's making a difference. You want it to be meaningful. But

Cassie Newell (18:32)
really?

Angela Haas (18:44)
when you put yourself out there and you work so hard and it means so much and then someone gives you a one or two star, especially the ones that don't leave any feedback, they just give you a one or two star, which we know those are trolls, but it still is like hurtful because there's so much significance and meaning to my work that I'm not just like doing it willy-nilly.

There's other strengths that help me deal with like letting that you have to let that stuff roll off, you know, because you get trapped into making it mean more than it should. So, but all of this to say, I think this is a great test. Although there's other tests that you can do for free. I know for sure there's a cost to this one. Correct? Isn't it at least $50?

Cassie Newell (19:12)
Right.

Right.

Yeah, so you can do the minimal cost

and I think you get like your top five or something in the themes report. I think it, I don't know, last time I checked, thought it was like $30 or something like that. I don't know. Yeah. And then Myers-Briggs, do you want to explain that? Like the different letters, the four letters and how that works since you're more familiar with that?

Angela Haas (19:36)
So.

30 to 50 maybe, yeah.

Sure, yeah.

Yeah, I use this a lot because it helps in with our staff for group communication training. Because each letter looks at different things. So the first letter is the direction we focus our attention and energy. The second one is the way we take in information.

The third is the way we make decisions. And the fourth is the way we act in our outer world, but I also think it's kind of how you organize your life or how you plan your life. And the Myers-Briggs was created by Katharine Briggs and Isabel Myers, and it's based on the psychological types created by Carl Jung. So there is a lot of science behind it, but over time, like, I use 16personalities.com.

because over time people have come up with different takes on it and different ways to offer it for free. So they're using the Katharine Briggs, Isabelle Meyers' principles, but they're also putting their own spin on it. So if you go to 16personalities.com, that's the test that I give all my staff. It takes about 12 minutes and

You can do it for free and if you want a more intensive report, you can pay a cost. And I definitely think it's worth it. I love the Myers-Briggs because I learned about myself, but I learned about how to collaborate with others. it's important to do for me because I learned how to communicate how I work better with other people.

For example, my Myers-Briggs is ENTJ. The E is extroversion. The other letter is I for introversion. And then the N for them is intuition, but that doesn't mean gut feeling. It's just the way they're calling, like how you take in information versus S for sensing. The third one is thinking.

versus feeling, which is an F. And then the last one is perceiving versus judging. And that's just how you organize your life. But when you're working with people, and especially people, my coworkers, a lot of the communication breakdown came between extroverts and introverts because of the way that they, introverts communicate inwardly and extroverts communicate outwardly. So when there's a meeting,

and the introverts aren't participating, the extroverts think they don't care. the one that is the most eye-opening for me, or the two, are the second letter and the fourth letters because I'm an N, which means I look at a picture and I see and make meaning and make sense out of what's in the picture.

If you're a strong S, you're more of a systems-based, you're the analyst, you're sort of just making a list of what you literally see in the picture. So, Ns are like the idea makers, where Ss are the systems people, yes. And as Ns, we make great writers because we have a bunch of ideas, we're able to make a story out of nothing.

Cassie Newell (23:02)
I'm an N.

right?

Angela Haas (23:14)
Whereas

we need sometimes help from Ss because they're the ones that are going to take that idea and help us implement it. I'm saying us is just general Ns I'm not saying you, cause you're a book coach, so you know how to do all this, but I'm saying just Ns in general. And sometimes I have too many ideas and that's where like understanding that part of my personality was like, okay, this is my idea machine going.

Cassie Newell (23:25)
Right.

You

Angela Haas (23:40)
I need to talk to someone who's more of a systems logistics person and they can help me The fourth letter, perceivers they love figuring things out as they go where a judger, it's not sitting in judgment of someone, it's judging things in the way like how you plan your life. So J's are planners, we like to have deadlines, we love

Cassie Newell (23:44)
Mm-hmm.

Angela Haas (24:06)
having limits, and that's how I function best. So I know I wasn't as effective in some writers groups because there were no deadlines and there was just sort of like, do what you want, figure it out. And that is the opposite of how I do best. So again, all this understanding about how you function helps you collaborate with others better, but also,

Cassie Newell (24:22)
Right.

Angela Haas (24:32)
helps you create some pretty interesting characters if you know how to use these kinds of tests. But the Myers-Briggs didn't really speak to you as much as it does me. So why is that?

Cassie Newell (24:41)
Mm. No.

yeah, I just was like, yeah, I mean, that's me, but it doesn't, to me, it just didn't dive in to the more specifics where I feel like Clifton's strengths really, I cause you're, looking at four main categories and then describing those categories in Myers-Briggs, you know, to an overall picture. For me,

The breakdown of the 34 individual pieces of a personality were just a little bit more meaningful. And then you've got also the themes of those personalities, and then you're seeing the visual grouping of it from a color coding perspective. Again, that might be the intuition piece. But you're seeing that, and you're going, OK, so I really lean in with influencing. OK, I get that, especially in my corporate life.

Angela Haas (25:10)
Right.

Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (25:34)
and in coaching to a certain degree, Maximizer. Yeah, that makes me one of the best cheerleading coaches you could ever have. but like, I don't know, I just like how, you know, too, as you get into it, you can see that not everything is a super high balcony strength for you at all times. And you ebb and flow through your strengths. That's why they talk about knowing your top 10.

Angela Haas (25:42)
Right.

Right.

Cassie Newell (26:03)
you know, because you will ebb and flow like some days, my relator is going to be off, but my strategic is going to be firing my, my communication and my command is hitting really hard. I do like to dictate writing that actually helps me go really fast when I really need to get an idea down. I have a shortcut on my keyboard and I just tap it twice and I start talking.

Angela Haas (26:18)
Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (26:26)
And then sometimes I'm like, okay, I'm done talking and I turn it off and I just start typing and then I'm off to the races. I used to get irritated because I had FOMO with O-Write. I had a friend that likes the competition in O-Write. I was like, how am gonna do this? Because I'm just not, and then I was like, okay, shortcut with my keyboard. And then I'd be talking and I'm sure they were thinking, good God.

Angela Haas (26:38)
Right, yeah.

Cassie Newell (26:51)
Is she typing like 500 words a minute here? You know, talking it all out. But nonetheless, I just I can lean in and out and I can tell when my self-assurance is hurting. Sometimes I don't readily see it. I've had coaches in the past who will be like your relator's hurting and your self-assurance is hurting from this particular thing that happened. And I go, OK. And then I go, how do I repair that? I know.

Angela Haas (26:54)
Ruh.

Cassie Newell (27:15)
And I think it's just that the specific breakdown of all those things that makes it more powerful for me than Myers-Briggs.

Angela Haas (27:24)
Yeah, yeah, I can totally see that and it's so valid and that's why I love that we're talking about the three different ones that we know the most about because

I think you find one that you really that speaks to you. And if that helps you and you can use it, that's great. For me, the Myers-Briggs, especially being extroverted and many, but not all authors we know tend to be more introverted. And when I was on calls in the beginning, when I was just starting to join groups and meet new people, I would be the first one to speak every time. And then I wouldn't shut up.

Cassie Newell (27:38)
Yeah.

Angela Haas (28:04)
because my communication is firing because no one else was speaking or answering questions. But then it was like, you know what? Once I, the Myers-Briggs started to really resonate with me and I started to understand how introverts focus their energy because it's not that they're not involved. It's not even that introverts are shy either.

It's just that they're a little bit more careful and thinking about what they're saying more than sort of just like I have what I call Hermione complex where I'm like raising my hand and I know the answer immediately and then I'm called upon and then I think I, yeah, okay, just start talking and the answer will come to you. Whereas introverts, they're more careful with just blurting something out. So now when I'm on calls, I count to like,

Cassie Newell (28:46)
Right.

Angela Haas (28:52)
10 or 20 when someone asks who wants to go first, so that it gives space to the more introverted people to actually speak instead of sucking all the air out of the call. And I had to learn that. And once I understood why I was doing it, then it's like, okay, that's a tool I can use to be better, to be better with groups. And then as far as my planner,

Cassie Newell (28:58)
Yeah.

Right.

Angela Haas (29:18)
I learned right away that I wasn't going to work with this editor because I said, when do you want this? When is my assignment due basically? And they're like, whenever you want to get it in, you know, whenever it's open, you know, we're just free and I'll just pick it up whenever. And I was like, you're my editor. I don't think so. You know, that doesn't, I'm not being critical of how that person works, but that I need that person to say, if you want this done by X date.

Cassie Newell (29:26)
Mm-hmm.

Angela Haas (29:47)
I need it by this time. That gives me a limit and a framework to work with. So that's how I'm using it and that's how it makes sense with me. but yeah, different for everyone.

Cassie Newell (29:57)
Yeah, that makes sense. And see,

being an E myself on the Myers-Briggs, go, I know myself and I'm really more of an Ambivert I mean, I have a lot of extraversion tendencies, but I also have to recover. I also can be by myself and not speak. Like I'm comfortable in those kinds of situations.

Angela Haas (30:07)
Right.

yeah!

Cassie Newell (30:20)
I don't know, the more I learned about Ambivert go, yeah, I'm more of an Ambivert than an extrovert. My husband, extreme extrovert. Me, I can play.

Angela Haas (30:28)
Bye.

Cassie Newell (30:30)
I'm not that way all the time.

Angela Haas (30:32)
Yes. Yeah, it's just good to know. And gives us things we can use for building characters too. The third one is the Enneagram. And that's the one that I think for both of us, I've seen a lot of other authors refer to it. They build characters around it. But for me, I've taken it, but...

Cassie Newell (30:41)
Absolutely.

Yeah.

Angela Haas (30:54)
It's almost too complicated for me. what is your Enneagram?

Cassie Newell (31:00)
So my Enneagram is type eight, the challenger. And then my wings, I think, are the bear and something else. Don't ask me. But I know Claire Taylor has a book out about the Enneagram and how to utilize that as an author and building characters and all of that. It just didn't speak to me that much. was kind of like, no, that's not really me, maybe kind of sort of. When I was reading it, it just didn't.

Angela Haas (31:05)
Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (31:26)
resonate and I took it as a part of an author course that I was doing that was more specifically around CliftonStrengths. And it was something Becca Syme had. So you took a number of personality tests, including the CliftonStrengths that was helping them also in coaching you.

Angela Haas (31:38)
Mm-hmm.

Cassie Newell (31:45)
So I just kind of, never really dove into it a lot because I was more interested on the CliftonStrengths side. So just the cursory read that I had, was just kind of like, yeah, okay. mean, that was just kind of my thought process. And I think the disc one that I took in the corporate world, was like influencing and dominating. And I was like, yeah, well, yeah, sure. You know, it's just kind of some of these tests, you go, sure.

Angela Haas (31:57)
Yeah.

Cassie Newell (32:11)
but it didn't resonate with me very well.

Angela Haas (32:14)
Yeah,

it didn't for me as well because there's only nine types, which sounds like a lot, but I feel like it kind of put me in a box where it didn't quite... Yeah, same. I took it and I was like, well, it's kind of me, but not really. However, I think for listeners who don't know, again, you should try all three. You can do...

Cassie Newell (32:21)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Angela Haas (32:40)
I some form of these for free because there's other websites that execute these tests except for CliftonStrengths. I think you can only take that on their website. But I think it's good to have because you might be in a group and someone asks you. And at least I know I'm in a gram one, which is the reformer.

Cassie Newell (32:45)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Angela Haas (33:02)
Uh, principled, purposeful, self-controlled and perfectionistic. yes, um, perfectionistic is definitely how I am as a writer, but then a lot of it, it goes into, yeah, wings and it just goes in other directions where I'm like, I don't know. It says bait. My basic fear is of being corrupt or evil or defective. I got to be honest, I don't know that that, I mean, I have a fear that I

Cassie Newell (33:17)
Yeah, I'm just looking at mine and I'm like.

I dunno, it's...

Angela Haas (33:32)
can't stop eating the potato chips that I've started. I have a fear, have much bigger fears, obviously, though we're not going into that in this episode, but like, I don't know that my principle navigating fear in the world is being corrupt or evil. Like, that doesn't resonate. Yeah.

Cassie Newell (33:50)
Yeah. The only

thing that resonated with me was it says that I tend to be more calm and passive than other typical eights because the challenger is kind of in your face. And then there's this aspect of a maverick that tends to be more responsible and careful. And I was like, well, okay. I don't know. To me, it was just, I probably should like.

Angela Haas (34:10)
Hmm, yeah.

Cassie Newell (34:13)
relook at it, maybe get more educated on it. But for me, I just kind of gravitated to Clifton strengths because it resonated. I understand it. And, you know, I've kind of worked to understand my strengths specifically, don't ask me about restorative adaptability there at the very bottom for me. ⁓ But the things I do know, and I understand the themes to I think I just, it's helped me a lot.

Angela Haas (34:22)
Yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

Cassie Newell (34:42)
in my personal life, my corporate life, and of course my creative life. So yeah.

Angela Haas (34:47)
Yeah,

there's some other websites. I think it's called Truity. I think that's a website where you can take a bunch of different personality tests as well. We'll put those in the show notes so that people can look at them. But again, I think it just, it helps you understand yourself and how to communicate yourself to others when you're collaborating can help you with characters.

understanding and empowering your writing strengths and where your weaknesses may be. updates, personal updates, what's going on for you?

Cassie Newell (35:19)
had to think about this, but my personal bookshop is open.

Angela Haas (35:23)
That's exciting. So much work.

Cassie Newell (35:25)
I can't believe

I was doing it, but I did it and made some decisions on how I was going to do it. And I'm kind of slow rolling. And I'm okay with that. don't need all the fancy things. So I'm just happy people can purchase the print copies from me and things like that. And then my audio books have started. The recordings have begun. that's...

Super exciting for

Angela Haas (35:50)
That's exciting.

Cassie Newell (35:51)
me too. What about you?

Angela Haas (35:52)
I am halfway finished with my next romance and then have started the audiobook on My Plus One Equals You. So really excited about that. Just trying to write as much as possible and do all the other life things. So yeah, exciting. You know what time it is.

Cassie Newell (36:12)
exciting.

Table topics. Bring it on.

Angela Haas (36:19)
Hello, that was good one. All right. What would be the one good thing about being the opposite sex?

Cassie Newell (36:30)
Peeing standing up.

Angela Haas (36:32)
What?

If I had to guess what you were gonna say, well, you know what, no, I'm not surprised. I'm in shock.

Cassie Newell (36:44)
to be the best, right?

Angela Haas (36:46)
Yeah, just a quick... I think...

Cassie Newell (36:49)
The other

thing, never having to deal with a menstrual cycle. And all of the activity, that's it. yeah. That's my answer.

Angela Haas (36:53)
Ugh. I think that's it.

I think so. I think that's my

answer. It's just not having to... Although men have their own things that they deal with, but yeah, not having a menstrual cycle. I was just trying to be diplomatic. It's just trying to be diplomatic for our male listeners. We love you guys. yeah, the menstrual cycle thing, I... Yeah, that's horrendous. is...

Cassie Newell (37:09)
Please, you know as another woman, is that even comparable?

Sorry, I'm just gonna tell it like it is.

Angela Haas (37:27)
Yeah, terrible. We're not going to go into that because what we're going to do is thank our listeners for joining us today. Don't forget to give us a review and rating where every listen to the podcast, it really helps us with visibility. Next week, we are going to talk about some of our favorite industry professionals that we love and use. And we are going to talk about

how to walk away or know when something isn't working out and give you some tips and tools to maybe seek someone else if your collaboration isn't doing what you need it to do. So until then keep writing, keep doing. We'll see you soon.